Discussion:
Sursound Digest, Vol 116, Issue 3
(too old to reply)
Dave Hunt
2018-03-08 09:50:49 UTC
Permalink
Hi,

Mac Minis are not that expensive, though whether they are adequate depends on how much audio processing is required.

After set up you may not need a monitor, keyboard or mouse, though these are fairly cheap and readily available now. These are only required if something goes wrong, usually when an audio interface or other external unit is not powered up when the computer boots.They can be set up to boot and run a program automatically to specified times, or to run a program when booted.

If it is a long term install, the cost of this part of the system becomes very low compared to other installation costs, and the daily management of the whole.

Ciao,

Dave Hunt
Subject: Re: [Sursound] realtime 5.1 streaming over hdmi ?
Date: 7 March 2018 18:37:46 GMT
Yes we got it working immediately on the Mac - one channel on speaker.bBut
obviously there's an extra cist involved for client if they have to buy a
Mac! Its a longterm install.
The Mac HDMI out sounds like your best bet. You may need to work with the
audio-midi-setup app to make it work (seeting the # of channels and then
assignments in 'configure speakers').
jim
Marc Lavallée
2018-03-08 13:35:14 UTC
Permalink
Le Thu, 8 Mar 2018 09:50:49 +0000
Post by Dave Hunt
Hi,
Mac Minis are not that expensive, though whether they are adequate
depends on how much audio processing is required.
After set up you may not need a monitor, keyboard or mouse, though
these are fairly cheap and readily available now. These are only
required if something goes wrong, usually when an audio interface or
other external unit is not powered up when the computer boots.They
can be set up to boot and run a program automatically to specified
times, or to run a program when booted.
If it is a long term install, the cost of this part of the system
becomes very low compared to other installation costs, and the daily
management of the whole.
Ciao,
Dave Hunt
Hi Dave.

I agree with you, but using mac minis (or any computer with any os) for
permanent installations requires a bit more care, because if something
can go wrong, it will go wrong. The software and hardware must be
monitored and restarted automatically if required (unless someone can
do it). I had to wrote a custom watchdog software for the mac, each OS
is a bit different, and nothing of that sort is available for the "art"
market. The computer could also be connected to the Internet for
(some) remote maintenance. So in the end using a mac or anything else
doesn't matter. What's really important is documentation for short-term
maintenance, mean-term update and long-term restauration, because
computers (and humans) will all fail at some point. In my experience,
using the MacOS is a recipe for quasi-disaster after 5 years. Windows
is (strangely enough) a bit more stable (10 years maybe). With Linux
it's a different game (but I'm not going to explain here).

--
Marc
Post by Dave Hunt
Subject: Re: [Sursound] realtime 5.1 streaming over hdmi ?
Date: 7 March 2018 18:37:46 GMT
Yes we got it working immediately on the Mac - one channel on
speaker.bBut obviously there's an extra cist involved for client if
they have to buy a Mac! Its a longterm install.
The Mac HDMI out sounds like your best bet. You may need to work
with the audio-midi-setup app to make it work (seeting the # of
channels and then assignments in 'configure speakers').
jim
_______________________________________________
Sursound mailing list
https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe
here, edit account or options, view archives and so on.
Augustine Leudar
2018-03-08 13:54:51 UTC
Permalink
Hi Marc,
The processing involve dhere is not too CPU intensive - rather its whether
the graphics card is capable of transmitting 8 channels of audio over HDMI
that I am wondering about .
Marc - its a commercial project and we will be connected online to
update/make changes if necessary. As mentioned its possible to
automatically tell the max patch which drivers ot use etc. I totally agree
with you on "if it can go wrong it will" and it has to be rock solid - the
last permanent install we did the cleaners kept unpluggin it - - we'd get
the call "its not working !!) - wed drive two hours to ge tthere and switch
it back on. Lessons learnt. Linux would be my prefferedd choice for
stablitiy but it doesnt have the software tools to do what is needed in
this instance (Im a big fan of soundscape renderer on linux ) nor are those
involved in the project profficient in Linux. I have however found windows
10 to be a complete pain in the ass for anything thats installed for more
than a couple of days. This will be for a year.
best
Gus
Post by Dave Hunt
Hi,
Mac Minis are not that expensive, though whether they are adequate depends
on how much audio processing is required.
After set up you may not need a monitor, keyboard or mouse, though these
are fairly cheap and readily available now. These are only required if
something goes wrong, usually when an audio interface or other external
unit is not powered up when the computer boots.They can be set up to boot
and run a program automatically to specified times, or to run a program
when booted.
If it is a long term install, the cost of this part of the system becomes
very low compared to other installation costs, and the daily management of
the whole.
Ciao,
Dave Hunt
Subject: Re: [Sursound] realtime 5.1 streaming over hdmi ?
Date: 7 March 2018 18:37:46 GMT
Yes we got it working immediately on the Mac - one channel on
speaker.bBut
obviously there's an extra cist involved for client if they have to buy a
Mac! Its a longterm install.
The Mac HDMI out sounds like your best bet. You may need to work with
the
audio-midi-setup app to make it work (seeting the # of channels and then
assignments in 'configure speakers').
jim
_______________________________________________
Sursound mailing list
https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe here,
edit account or options, view archives and so on.
--
Dr. Augustine Leudar
Artistic Director Magik Door LTD
Company Number : NI635217
Registered 63 Ballycoan rd,
Belfast BT88LL
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Aaron Heller
2018-03-09 04:59:46 UTC
Permalink
I have a "Mid-2010" Mac Mini connected to a Sherwood Newcastle R-972 via
HDMI. The "direct" input to the receiver shows up on the Mac Mini as an
8-channel audio output device. I'm not a MaxMSP user but it works fine with
Plogue Bidule. You set up the channel mappings with the Audio MIDI Setup
program.

Aaron Heller
Menlo Park, CA US
Post by Augustine Leudar
Hi Marc,
The processing involve dhere is not too CPU intensive - rather its whether
the graphics card is capable of transmitting 8 channels of audio over HDMI
that I am wondering about .
Marc - its a commercial project and we will be connected online to
update/make changes if necessary. As mentioned its possible to
automatically tell the max patch which drivers ot use etc. I totally agree
with you on "if it can go wrong it will" and it has to be rock solid - the
last permanent install we did the cleaners kept unpluggin it - - we'd get
the call "its not working !!) - wed drive two hours to ge tthere and switch
it back on. Lessons learnt. Linux would be my prefferedd choice for
stablitiy but it doesnt have the software tools to do what is needed in
this instance (Im a big fan of soundscape renderer on linux ) nor are those
involved in the project profficient in Linux. I have however found windows
10 to be a complete pain in the ass for anything thats installed for more
than a couple of days. This will be for a year.
best
Gus
Post by Dave Hunt
Hi,
Mac Minis are not that expensive, though whether they are adequate depends
on how much audio processing is required.
After set up you may not need a monitor, keyboard or mouse, though these
are fairly cheap and readily available now. These are only required if
something goes wrong, usually when an audio interface or other external
unit is not powered up when the computer boots.They can be set up to boot
and run a program automatically to specified times, or to run a program
when booted.
If it is a long term install, the cost of this part of the system becomes
very low compared to other installation costs, and the daily management of
the whole.
Ciao,
Dave Hunt
Subject: Re: [Sursound] realtime 5.1 streaming over hdmi ?
Date: 7 March 2018 18:37:46 GMT
Yes we got it working immediately on the Mac - one channel on
speaker.bBut
obviously there's an extra cist involved for client if they have to buy a
Mac! Its a longterm install.
The Mac HDMI out sounds like your best bet. You may need to work with
the
audio-midi-setup app to make it work (seeting the # of channels and then
assignments in 'configure speakers').
jim
_______________________________________________
Sursound mailing list
https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe here,
edit account or options, view archives and so on.
--
Dr. Augustine Leudar
Artistic Director Magik Door LTD
Company Number : NI635217
Registered 63 Ballycoan rd,
Belfast BT88LL
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Post by Augustine Leudar
_______________________________________________
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Aaron Heller
2018-03-09 05:03:45 UTC
Permalink
One more detail... I had to create an Aggregate audio device to get it
working with Jack. I don't remember the details, but could refresh my
memory if anyone needs them.
Post by Aaron Heller
I have a "Mid-2010" Mac Mini connected to a Sherwood Newcastle R-972 via
HDMI. The "direct" input to the receiver shows up on the Mac Mini as an
8-channel audio output device. I'm not a MaxMSP user but it works fine with
Plogue Bidule. You set up the channel mappings with the Audio MIDI Setup
program.
Aaron Heller
Menlo Park, CA US
On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 5:54 AM, Augustine Leudar <
Post by Augustine Leudar
Hi Marc,
The processing involve dhere is not too CPU intensive - rather its
whether
Post by Augustine Leudar
the graphics card is capable of transmitting 8 channels of audio over
HDMI
Post by Augustine Leudar
that I am wondering about .
Marc - its a commercial project and we will be connected online to
update/make changes if necessary. As mentioned its possible to
automatically tell the max patch which drivers ot use etc. I totally
agree
Post by Augustine Leudar
with you on "if it can go wrong it will" and it has to be rock solid -
the
Post by Augustine Leudar
last permanent install we did the cleaners kept unpluggin it - - we'd get
the call "its not working !!) - wed drive two hours to ge tthere and
switch
Post by Augustine Leudar
it back on. Lessons learnt. Linux would be my prefferedd choice for
stablitiy but it doesnt have the software tools to do what is needed in
this instance (Im a big fan of soundscape renderer on linux ) nor are
those
Post by Augustine Leudar
involved in the project profficient in Linux. I have however found
windows
Post by Augustine Leudar
10 to be a complete pain in the ass for anything thats installed for more
than a couple of days. This will be for a year.
best
Gus
Post by Dave Hunt
Hi,
Mac Minis are not that expensive, though whether they are adequate
depends
Post by Augustine Leudar
Post by Dave Hunt
on how much audio processing is required.
After set up you may not need a monitor, keyboard or mouse, though
these
Post by Augustine Leudar
Post by Dave Hunt
are fairly cheap and readily available now. These are only required if
something goes wrong, usually when an audio interface or other external
unit is not powered up when the computer boots.They can be set up to
boot
Post by Augustine Leudar
Post by Dave Hunt
and run a program automatically to specified times, or to run a program
when booted.
If it is a long term install, the cost of this part of the system
becomes
Post by Augustine Leudar
Post by Dave Hunt
very low compared to other installation costs, and the daily
management of
Post by Augustine Leudar
Post by Dave Hunt
the whole.
Ciao,
Dave Hunt
Subject: Re: [Sursound] realtime 5.1 streaming over hdmi ?
Date: 7 March 2018 18:37:46 GMT
Yes we got it working immediately on the Mac - one channel on
speaker.bBut
obviously there's an extra cist involved for client if they have to
buy a
Post by Augustine Leudar
Post by Dave Hunt
Mac! Its a longterm install.
The Mac HDMI out sounds like your best bet. You may need to work
with
Post by Augustine Leudar
Post by Dave Hunt
the
audio-midi-setup app to make it work (seeting the # of channels and
then
Post by Augustine Leudar
Post by Dave Hunt
assignments in 'configure speakers').
jim
_______________________________________________
Sursound mailing list
https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe
here,
Post by Augustine Leudar
Post by Dave Hunt
edit account or options, view archives and so on.
--
Dr. Augustine Leudar
Artistic Director Magik Door LTD
Company Number : NI635217
Registered 63 Ballycoan rd,
Belfast BT88LL
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Post by Augustine Leudar
_______________________________________________
Sursound mailing list
https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe here,
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Marc Lavallée
2018-03-09 14:06:16 UTC
Permalink
Hi Gus.

True that Windows 10 is horrible, except maybe for the Entreprise
version without all the builtin consumer spywares, but I don't think
this version is easily available. I tried Windows 10 on a double-boot
Android/Windows tablet, and it was so bad that I erased it to keep only
Android... I used Windows 8.1 to setup permanent installations (not my
choice, as an employee) and they will work well (for a little while).

A permanent installation *must* be cleaner proof; it should be capable
of (re)starting up automagically when power is applied. If it's not
possible (without an expert on the spot), a U.P.S. helps a lot, but
it's not enough.

Electronic art deserves the same care (and love/budget) than industrial
processes; it's possible (in part) even with consumer-grade computing
equipment like mac minis, but each version of OSX (and Windows) are
different and anything that Apple (and Microsoft) are adding to "help
users" must be disabled in order to control the OS at a lower level.
My experience was that it's a lot more work to properly setup and test a
mac mini or a Windows machine than a Linux machine.

I hope than the younger generation of electronic artists will discover
and adopt free software with the use of "Raspberry Pi" like computing
devices; some of them have features like eMMC disks and battery power
management. They are cheap, reliable, small, and many of then can
stream 7.1 over over HDMI... If there's a demand, Max/MSP could
definitely run on such devices...

That said, I will soon work on a new project and part of it will run on
Max/MSP because one of the collaborator knows it well.

I wish you good luck this year!
--
Marc

Le Thu, 8 Mar 2018 13:54:51 +0000
Post by Augustine Leudar
Hi Marc,
The processing involve dhere is not too CPU intensive - rather its
whether the graphics card is capable of transmitting 8 channels of
audio over HDMI that I am wondering about .
Marc - its a commercial project and we will be connected online to
update/make changes if necessary. As mentioned its possible to
automatically tell the max patch which drivers ot use etc. I totally
agree with you on "if it can go wrong it will" and it has to be rock
solid - the last permanent install we did the cleaners kept unpluggin
it - - we'd get the call "its not working !!) - wed drive two hours
to ge tthere and switch it back on. Lessons learnt. Linux would be my
prefferedd choice for stablitiy but it doesnt have the software tools
to do what is needed in this instance (Im a big fan of soundscape
renderer on linux ) nor are those involved in the project profficient
in Linux. I have however found windows 10 to be a complete pain in
the ass for anything thats installed for more than a couple of days.
This will be for a year. best
Gus
Post by Dave Hunt
Hi,
Mac Minis are not that expensive, though whether they are adequate
depends on how much audio processing is required.
After set up you may not need a monitor, keyboard or mouse, though
these are fairly cheap and readily available now. These are only
required if something goes wrong, usually when an audio interface
or other external unit is not powered up when the computer
boots.They can be set up to boot and run a program automatically to
specified times, or to run a program when booted.
If it is a long term install, the cost of this part of the system
becomes very low compared to other installation costs, and the
daily management of the whole.
Ciao,
Dave Hunt
Subject: Re: [Sursound] realtime 5.1 streaming over hdmi ?
Date: 7 March 2018 18:37:46 GMT
Yes we got it working immediately on the Mac - one channel on
speaker.bBut
obviously there's an extra cist involved for client if they have
to buy a Mac! Its a longterm install.
The Mac HDMI out sounds like your best bet. You may need to work with
the
audio-midi-setup app to make it work (seeting the # of channels
and then assignments in 'configure speakers').
jim
_______________________________________________
Sursound mailing list
https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe
here, edit account or options, view archives and so on.
s***@mail.telepac.pt
2018-03-10 20:23:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marc Lavallée
Hi Gus.
True that Windows 10 is horrible, except maybe for the Entreprise
version without all the builtin consumer spywares, but I don't think
this version is easily available. I tried Windows 10 on a double-boot
Android/Windows tablet, and it was so bad that I erased it to keep only
Android... I used Windows 8.1 to setup permanent installations (not my
choice, as an employee) and they will work well (for a little while).
Now I can't resist:

1. Are you sure that Android is any less spyware than Windows10?

(Because most people seem to think otherwise...)

2. Is Windows 10 really so horrible on tablets? (I see plenty of
professional people using Surface laptops/tablets.)

Not wanting to get into polemics, but Android is certainly not the
same as Linux. (Even if being based on Linux.)

Stefan

P.S.: And please, does Android support hdmi in any way better than
windows? Big doubts here...
Post by Marc Lavallée
A permanent installation *must* be cleaner proof; it should be capable
of (re)starting up automagically when power is applied. If it's not
possible (without an expert on the spot), a U.P.S. helps a lot, but
it's not enough.
Electronic art deserves the same care (and love/budget) than industrial
processes; it's possible (in part) even with consumer-grade computing
equipment like mac minis, but each version of OSX (and Windows) are
different and anything that Apple (and Microsoft) are adding to "help
users" must be disabled in order to control the OS at a lower level.
My experience was that it's a lot more work to properly setup and test a
mac mini or a Windows machine than a Linux machine.
I hope than the younger generation of electronic artists will discover
and adopt free software with the use of "Raspberry Pi" like computing
devices; some of them have features like eMMC disks and battery power
management. They are cheap, reliable, small, and many of then can
stream 7.1 over over HDMI... If there's a demand, Max/MSP could
definitely run on such devices...
That said, I will soon work on a new project and part of it will run on
Max/MSP because one of the collaborator knows it well.
I wish you good luck this year!
--
Marc
Le Thu, 8 Mar 2018 13:54:51 +0000
Post by Augustine Leudar
Hi Marc,
The processing involve dhere is not too CPU intensive - rather its
whether the graphics card is capable of transmitting 8 channels of
audio over HDMI that I am wondering about .
Marc - its a commercial project and we will be connected online to
update/make changes if necessary. As mentioned its possible to
automatically tell the max patch which drivers ot use etc. I totally
agree with you on "if it can go wrong it will" and it has to be rock
solid - the last permanent install we did the cleaners kept unpluggin
it - - we'd get the call "its not working !!) - wed drive two hours
to ge tthere and switch it back on. Lessons learnt. Linux would be my
prefferedd choice for stablitiy but it doesnt have the software tools
to do what is needed in this instance (Im a big fan of soundscape
renderer on linux ) nor are those involved in the project profficient
in Linux. I have however found windows 10 to be a complete pain in
the ass for anything thats installed for more than a couple of days.
This will be for a year. best
Gus
Hi,
Mac Minis are not that expensive, though whether they are adequate
depends on how much audio processing is required.
After set up you may not need a monitor, keyboard or mouse, though
these are fairly cheap and readily available now. These are only
required if something goes wrong, usually when an audio interface
or other external unit is not powered up when the computer
boots.They can be set up to boot and run a program automatically to
specified times, or to run a program when booted.
If it is a long term install, the cost of this part of the system
becomes very low compared to other installation costs, and the
daily management of the whole.
Ciao,
Dave Hunt
Subject: Re: [Sursound] realtime 5.1 streaming over hdmi ?
Date: 7 March 2018 18:37:46 GMT
Yes we got it working immediately on the Mac - one channel on
speaker.bBut
obviously there's an extra cist involved for client if they have
to buy a Mac! Its a longterm install.
The Mac HDMI out sounds like your best bet. You may need to work
with
the
audio-midi-setup app to make it work (seeting the # of channels
and then assignments in 'configure speakers').
jim
_______________________________________________
Sursound mailing list
https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe
here, edit account or options, view archives and so on.
_______________________________________________
Sursound mailing list
- unsubscribe here, edit account or options, view archives and so on.
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Marc Lavallée
2018-03-11 19:33:39 UTC
Permalink
Stefan,

GAFA is the main provider of spyware (a well documented subject).
At least Android is free software (or “open source”),
so some versions of Android are free of Google’s spywares,
There’s also quite a lot of free software for Android,
available from the F-Droid repository (and there’s probably others).

The specific problems I had with Windows 10 on my (cheap) PC tablet was:
- The whole system is a spy/bloatware, and the disk was almost full (of it)
- It was (too) often auto-updating, filling up the disk even more with incremental patches
- Softwares were running slow compared to similar Android apps
- I don’t (really) need a desktop OS on a tablet… It’d be nice, but I can live without it.
(As an experiment, I replaced Windows with Linux and it was running much better,
but I could not use it because some important features were still missing).

The Surface tablet computers from Microsoft are like iPads from Apple;
they are built and optimized by the company providing the OS.
Android (based on the Linux kernel and GNU software) is designed for generic computing devices,
and the companies selling such devices with Android are often doing a good job.
But Windows 10 on generic tablet PCs don’t seem to work well (at least for me).

Yes, HDMI seems to work well on my Android tablet.


Marc
Post by s***@mail.telepac.pt
Post by Marc Lavallée
Hi Gus.
True that Windows 10 is horrible, except maybe for the Entreprise
version without all the builtin consumer spywares, but I don't think
this version is easily available. I tried Windows 10 on a double-boot
Android/Windows tablet, and it was so bad that I erased it to keep only
Android... I used Windows 8.1 to setup permanent installations (not my
choice, as an employee) and they will work well (for a little while).
1. Are you sure that Android is any less spyware than Windows10?
(Because most people seem to think otherwise...)
2. Is Windows 10 really so horrible on tablets? (I see plenty of professional people using Surface laptops/tablets.)
Not wanting to get into polemics, but Android is certainly not the same as Linux. (Even if being based on Linux.)
Stefan
P.S.: And please, does Android support hdmi in any way better than windows? Big doubts here...
Post by Marc Lavallée
A permanent installation *must* be cleaner proof; it should be capable
of (re)starting up automagically when power is applied. If it's not
possible (without an expert on the spot), a U.P.S. helps a lot, but
it's not enough.
Electronic art deserves the same care (and love/budget) than industrial
processes; it's possible (in part) even with consumer-grade computing
equipment like mac minis, but each version of OSX (and Windows) are
different and anything that Apple (and Microsoft) are adding to "help
users" must be disabled in order to control the OS at a lower level.
My experience was that it's a lot more work to properly setup and test a
mac mini or a Windows machine than a Linux machine.
I hope than the younger generation of electronic artists will discover
and adopt free software with the use of "Raspberry Pi" like computing
devices; some of them have features like eMMC disks and battery power
management. They are cheap, reliable, small, and many of then can
stream 7.1 over over HDMI... If there's a demand, Max/MSP could
definitely run on such devices...
That said, I will soon work on a new project and part of it will run on
Max/MSP because one of the collaborator knows it well.
I wish you good luck this year!
--
Marc
Le Thu, 8 Mar 2018 13:54:51 +0000
Post by Augustine Leudar
Hi Marc,
The processing involve dhere is not too CPU intensive - rather its
whether the graphics card is capable of transmitting 8 channels of
audio over HDMI that I am wondering about .
Marc - its a commercial project and we will be connected online to
update/make changes if necessary. As mentioned its possible to
automatically tell the max patch which drivers ot use etc. I totally
agree with you on "if it can go wrong it will" and it has to be rock
solid - the last permanent install we did the cleaners kept unpluggin
it - - we'd get the call "its not working !!) - wed drive two hours
to ge tthere and switch it back on. Lessons learnt. Linux would be my
prefferedd choice for stablitiy but it doesnt have the software tools
to do what is needed in this instance (Im a big fan of soundscape
renderer on linux ) nor are those involved in the project profficient
in Linux. I have however found windows 10 to be a complete pain in
the ass for anything thats installed for more than a couple of days.
This will be for a year. best
Gus
Hi,
Mac Minis are not that expensive, though whether they are adequate
depends on how much audio processing is required.
After set up you may not need a monitor, keyboard or mouse, though
these are fairly cheap and readily available now. These are only
required if something goes wrong, usually when an audio interface
or other external unit is not powered up when the computer
boots.They can be set up to boot and run a program automatically to
specified times, or to run a program when booted.
If it is a long term install, the cost of this part of the system
becomes very low compared to other installation costs, and the
daily management of the whole.
Ciao,
Dave Hunt
Subject: Re: [Sursound] realtime 5.1 streaming over hdmi ?
Date: 7 March 2018 18:37:46 GMT
Yes we got it working immediately on the Mac - one channel on
speaker.bBut
obviously there's an extra cist involved for client if they have
to buy a Mac! Its a longterm install.
The Mac HDMI out sounds like your best bet. You may need to work
with
the
audio-midi-setup app to make it work (seeting the # of channels
and then assignments in 'configure speakers').
jim
_______________________________________________
Sursound mailing list
https://mail.music.vt.edu/mailman/listinfo/sursound - unsubscribe
here, edit account or options, view archives and so on.
_______________________________________________
Sursound mailing list
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s***@mail.telepac.pt
2018-03-11 20:17:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marc Lavallée
Stefan,
GAFA is the main provider of spyware (a well documented subject).
At least Android is free software (or “open source”),
so some versions of Android are free of Google’s spywares,
There’s also quite a lot of free software for Android,
available from the F-Droid repository (and there’s probably others).
Ok, now I see your point: You can install your own version of Android.

(But most people just use the Android they "get" i.e. buy, even not
being able to replace the OS.)
Post by Marc Lavallée
- The whole system is a spy/bloatware, and the disk was almost full (of it)
- It was (too) often auto-updating, filling up the disk even more with incremental patches
- Softwares were running slow compared to similar Android apps
- I don’t (really) need a desktop OS on a tablet… It’d be nice, but
I can live without it.
(As an experiment, I replaced Windows with Linux and it was running much better,
but I could not use it because some important features were still missing).
Good point. Linux needs some convincing tablet (touch) version, still...
Post by Marc Lavallée
The Surface tablet computers from Microsoft are like iPads from Apple;
they are built and optimized by the company providing the OS.
Android (based on the Linux kernel and GNU software) is designed
for generic computing devices,
and the companies selling such devices with Android are often doing a good job.
But Windows 10 on generic tablet PCs don’t seem to work well (at least for me).
Yes, HDMI seems to work well on my Android tablet.
Thanks, we are now far beyond "basic OS bashing"...  😉

Stefan
Post by Marc Lavallée

Marc
Post by s***@mail.telepac.pt
Post by Marc Lavallée
Hi Gus.
True that Windows 10 is horrible, except maybe for the Entreprise
version without all the builtin consumer spywares, but I don't think
this version is easily available. I tried Windows 10 on a double-boot
Android/Windows tablet, and it was so bad that I erased it to keep only
Android... I used Windows 8.1 to setup permanent installations (not my
choice, as an employee) and they will work well (for a little while).
1. Are you sure that Android is any less spyware than Windows10?
(Because most people seem to think otherwise...)
2. Is Windows 10 really so horrible on tablets? (I see plenty of
professional people using Surface laptops/tablets.)
Not wanting to get into polemics, but Android is certainly not the
same as Linux. (Even if being based on Linux.)
Stefan
P.S.: And please, does Android support hdmi in any way better than
windows? Big doubts here...
Post by Marc Lavallée
A permanent installation *must* be cleaner proof; it should be capable
of (re)starting up automagically when power is applied. If it's not
possible (without an expert on the spot), a U.P.S. helps a lot, but
it's not enough.
Electronic art deserves the same care (and love/budget) than industrial
processes; it's possible (in part) even with consumer-grade computing
equipment like mac minis, but each version of OSX (and Windows) are
different and anything that Apple (and Microsoft) are adding to "help
users" must be disabled in order to control the OS at a lower level.
My experience was that it's a lot more work to properly setup and test a
mac mini or a Windows machine than a Linux machine.
I hope than the younger generation of electronic artists will discover
and adopt free software with the use of "Raspberry Pi" like computing
devices; some of them have features like eMMC disks and battery power
management. They are cheap, reliable, small, and many of then can
stream 7.1 over over HDMI... If there's a demand, Max/MSP could
definitely run on such devices...
That said, I will soon work on a new project and part of it will run on
Max/MSP because one of the collaborator knows it well.
I wish you good luck this year!
--
Marc
Le Thu, 8 Mar 2018 13:54:51 +0000
Post by Augustine Leudar
Hi Marc,
The processing involve dhere is not too CPU intensive - rather its
whether the graphics card is capable of transmitting 8 channels of
audio over HDMI that I am wondering about .
Marc - its a commercial project and we will be connected online to
update/make changes if necessary. As mentioned its possible to
automatically tell the max patch which drivers ot use etc. I totally
agree with you on "if it can go wrong it will" and it has to be rock
solid - the last permanent install we did the cleaners kept unpluggin
it - - we'd get the call "its not working !!) - wed drive two hours
to ge tthere and switch it back on. Lessons learnt. Linux would be my
prefferedd choice for stablitiy but it doesnt have the software tools
to do what is needed in this instance (Im a big fan of soundscape
renderer on linux ) nor are those involved in the project profficient
in Linux. I have however found windows 10 to be a complete pain in
the ass for anything thats installed for more than a couple of days.
This will be for a year. best
Gus
Hi,
Mac Minis are not that expensive, though whether they are adequate
depends on how much audio processing is required.
After set up you may not need a monitor, keyboard or mouse, though
these are fairly cheap and readily available now. These are only
required if something goes wrong, usually when an audio interface
or other external unit is not powered up when the computer
boots.They can be set up to boot and run a program automatically to
specified times, or to run a program when booted.
If it is a long term install, the cost of this part of the system
becomes very low compared to other installation costs, and the
daily management of the whole.
Ciao,
Dave Hunt
Subject: Re: [Sursound] realtime 5.1 streaming over hdmi ?
Date: 7 March 2018 18:37:46 GMT
Yes we got it working immediately on the Mac - one channel on
speaker.bBut
obviously there's an extra cist involved for client if they have
to buy a Mac! Its a longterm install.
The Mac HDMI out sounds like your best bet. You may need to work
with
the
audio-midi-setup app to make it work (seeting the # of channels
and then assignments in 'configure speakers').
jim
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Marc Lavallée
2018-03-13 00:07:03 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 11 Mar 2018 20:17:38 +0000
Post by s***@mail.telepac.pt
Post by Marc Lavallée
GAFA is the main provider of spyware (a well documented subject).
At least Android is free software (or “open source”),
so some versions of Android are free of Google’s spywares,
There’s also quite a lot of free software for Android,
available from the F-Droid repository (and there’s probably others).
Ok, now I see your point: You can install your own version of Android.
(But most people just use the Android they "get" i.e. buy, even not
being able to replace the OS.)
<OT++>

Most people won't know and won't care, but it's fairly "easy" (or not
too difficult) to disable many Google apps and services on any Android
devices; as a new user, skip the creation of a Google account, then
disable all things related to Google in settings/apps. It won't get
rid of all surveillance activities, but it's a good start... When
possible (not all devices are supported) it is just easier and safer to
install a custom Android firmware, because none of that extra
customization is required. Then, as a rule of thumb, use only free
software from the F-Droid and Guardian Project repos, install a safer
browser (Firefox Klar or OrFox), and if the phone is rooted install an
ad-blocker based on firewall rules. A safer device also runs faster
and requires less power, which is a good thing when used as an
ambisonic recorder or player...

</OT++>
--
Marc

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